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Entry # Time Turn Player Title Entry
52 1/17/2018 2:35:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Message Aristocrats done - to the Eurypontids.
51 1/17/2018 9:38:00 AM Turn 1 Agiad Message Issue in Corinth. Aristocrats next.
50 1/16/2018 9:56:00 PM Turn 1 Demagogues Message Issue in Sparta.
Agiads next.
49 1/16/2018 7:29:00 PM Turn 1 Eurypontid Message Issue placed. Over to Demagogue faction.
48 1/16/2018 2:40:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Message Aristocrats issue placed - to Eurypontid
47 1/16/2018 1:29:00 PM Turn 1 Agiad Message Ok, my placememnt done, to Arictocrats (Scott)
46 1/16/2018 4:01:00 AM Turn 1 Agiad Message Hi Guys,
I am pretty busy last couple of days thus no messages from me. I hope to find time tonight to progress with game.
45 1/14/2018 4:52:00 AM Turn 1 Demagogues Message I've updated the log (number 115) with the results of the Spartan assembly. We must have started from the wrong log because not all of your Boule issues were there but it doesn't matter and was easily fixed. Could you guys just check it's okay from your end?

The logs aren't synchronised but all Brian and Michal have to do in each of your next logs is:
- Discard your hands
- Draw the Strategos you won

I've done the pre-theatre issue resolution. We're at war!

Theatre issues are assigned.

Honour order is Demagogues-Agiad-Aristocrats-Eurypontid

Just a couple of tips for issue placement:

- We were initially masking and trying to shuffle our issues on the board, which was awkward and unsatisfactory. I found you can move your issues to your hand, placing them on the empty draw spaces....one on each works best as experimenting revealed that each space only holds 4 issues max. This works really well, gets around messy counter shuffling on the board and is more like the board game where your issues are out of sight behind your screen.

- As issues accumulate in theatres it can be hard to tell where a new one is placed in a log and announcing your theatre placement in the text field helps keep it clear.

I thought that as I'm first up I'd save time and place my first issue.

Agiads up next.
44 1/13/2018 9:31:00 PM Turn 1 Eurypontid Message I think Michal initially thought that I had removed some issues from the board, but then he realized that I had just stacked them. So our final file shows the correct issues won by each side. Agiad faction did win the Ostracism issue.
43 1/13/2018 3:34:00 PM Turn 1 Demagogues Message Just a quick look before really heading out the door and yes, I'll be first in honour order. To update the log I'll just need to clarify the results of the Spartan assembly, particularly issues won by each side (Michal, your text in the last log indicated there were some missing issues?), and confirm Agiads won the Ostracism. I'll update the log with those results tonight.
42 1/13/2018 3:16:00 PM Turn 1 Demagogues Message Scott and I have done the Athenian assembly and it should be in the Dropbox.

I'm out the door to work but I'll have a look at the Spartan assembly tonight. I think I'll be first in honour order so we'll probably use the Athenian log as the primary one and update it with the results of the Spartan one.
41 1/10/2018 4:03:00 PM Turn 1 Agiad Message Scott,
do not worry. We will wait - take your time and keep us updated.
40 1/10/2018 5:06:00 AM Turn 1 Aristocrats Message My apologies to everyone - I think I've been the slow person on this one. If you're still willing to try to give it a go, I'd like to see if we can still make it work out. My schedule is regular now, so if we can manage, I'd like to give it a try.
39 1/6/2018 5:13:00 PM Turn 1 Demagogues Message We're still there and trying to arrange a time to play. I'm sorry guys, it would have been quicker after all to do this PBEM. When work and various family emergencies and other commitments allow, we'll get it done. Won't be long.
38 12/29/2017 4:52:00 AM Turn 1 Demagogues Message Well done, guys. That was lightning fast for PBEM.

Between my work schedule and Scott's family commitments we're having some delay in getting our assembly done. Hopefully won't be too long.
37 12/27/2017 9:10:00 AM Turn 1 Eurypontid Message FYI - Sparta has completed the Assembly phase, and the Political phase up through the Strategy Board segment (7.3).
36 12/25/2017 3:57:00 AM Turn 1 Agiad Message Hi Scott,
thanks for greetings! And also Merry Christmas to everybody!

pS. We slowly progress with Assembly phase...
35 12/24/2017 5:36:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Message Merry Christmas to all!
34 12/24/2017 2:27:00 AM Turn 1 Aristocrats Message Brent - I think we can make something work with next week, but my schedule is pretty crazy. Everyone is at my house. What day/time are you thinking?

Sucks to be working the night shift this week. I feel for you.
33 12/23/2017 8:15:00 PM Turn 1 Eurypontid Message I placed my 2 issues, which concludes the Boule segment. I don't think I'll be able to do any live play, but hopefully we can get through the debate segment by the start of the new year.

======
32 12/23/2017 5:13:00 PM Turn 1 Demagogues Message 2 issues chosen and to the Euros to finish the Boule, then I think splitting up for the Assemblies is the way to go.

Xmas Eve here (we're first in in the Xmas theatre issue queue, except for New Zealand :) and I'll be out of action for the next 2 days.

I start work on Xmas night :( and will be on night shifts up until New Year. That's usually incompatible with live play but there will be a window in the 9 to 10 pm timeframe at your end, Scott, to do the Assembly if you're free in the post - Xmas week. If you're doing more important things like going away or spending time with family, no problem, we can do it afterwards. It will only take about 20 minutes.

Merry Xmas all. Hope you have a safe, quiet, relaxing one.

Brent.
31 12/23/2017 4:58:00 AM Turn 1 Agiad Message My 3 issues chosen now to Athens/Brent
30 12/22/2017 3:34:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Message Apologies - I thought we alternated. Correction done; just did the other two issues.
29 12/22/2017 2:44:00 PM Turn 1 Eurypontid Message Hi Scott,

It looked like you put only one issue (Games) in the zero space. I think you are supposed to choose 3 issues and put them in the zero space (see 5.32.C).

========
28 12/22/2017 2:39:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Message Athens AF done - did one issue to center. To the Agiad!
27 12/21/2017 6:18:00 PM Turn 1 Eurypontid Message Athens AF is up.
26 12/21/2017 6:05:00 PM Turn 1 Demagogues Message Demos, done, Euros up.

Michal, technically the honour counters are for the Theatre segment and honour order will almost certainly have changed by the time we get to that. I've not used them for the Boule before because I've never played it sequentially but am certainly happy for you to do so.....except that we're almost finished :)
25 12/21/2017 5:20:00 PM Turn 1 Agiad Message My move done (not very original - I took League). Now back to Athens (Brent).

One question: I think we should put Honor markers (1-4) next to the appropriate factions?


24 12/20/2017 7:10:00 PM Turn 1 Demagogues Message Thanks Scott. It's actually Agiad up next.......then Demagogues, then Eurypontid. There will be two rounds of issue placement (your next will be 3 issues in the centre), then we can spilt off and go to the Assembly.
23 12/20/2017 6:09:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Message Athens did first play for Boule phase - apologies for the slow response. Crazy couple days, with the holidays closing in.

Demogogues next? How are we playing this?
22 12/19/2017 1:38:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Message I've been consumed with work the past couple days - I'll kick off the boule phase tonight. Sorry for the delay guys!
21 12/17/2017 10:51:00 AM Turn 1 Agiad Message Brian, thanks for quick response. Fully agree that even if issue is selected, it might not be won. That is why I commented that I am probably over-calculating (though, in such complex game details matter).

So let us have Boule in sequence (Scott, as Brent said, this would mean that you're first up with log 105 to place an issue on your 2 space). And assembly in separate, 2 players teams to move it quickly forward.

20 12/17/2017 8:57:00 AM Turn 1 Eurypontid Message I just thought I'd point out that just because the War/Peace issue is selected during the Boule segment, doesn't mean it will be debated during the Assembly phase.

Further, sometimes an issue gets debated and the result is a tie, so the issue remains in the zero space. So unless you are going to monitor the results of the assembly phase, it doesn't necessarily buy you anything to do the Boule segment sequentially.

I don't really care which way we do it. I think there are pros and cons to each approach.
19 12/17/2017 8:38:00 AM Turn 1 Agiad Message Hi Brent,

I think Boule segment being sequential, and Assembly Phase done separately, concurrently should do a trick.
18 12/17/2017 5:32:00 AM Turn 1 Demagogues Message Thanks, Michal.

I can see what you're saying. There are issues that are dependent on War/Peace status, being Agoge and Colony, and to a lesser extent, Games. My own preference for a dynamic game on the table would be to play Boule and Assembly segments simultaneously without watching the other faction and I think this is the default style Mark Herman had intended (the sequential play option is given as an alternative).....but I would be flexible around the preferences of whoever was playing.

I'm happy to go with a sequential Boule, as you've outlined, and maybe then pair off for the Assembly.

Scott, this would mean that you're first up with log 105 to place an issue on your 2 space.
17 12/17/2017 5:10:00 AM Turn 1 Agiad Message Correction: of course for Colony to be played, there should be PEACE, so no War/Peace issue play by Athens.
16 12/17/2017 5:02:00 AM Turn 1 Agiad Message Thanks Brent for sharing all experiences. I would like to clarify some points:
I understand we have separate logs for Athens and Sparta only for Boule and Assembly phase. But do we keep a sequence or do we do it simultaneously? As per 5.32 both options are available. However, from my board sessions of Pericles (face-to-face) it was really key for Sparta to see what Athens does.

While it can be cumbersome and lengthily for Assembly Phase, I think this is pretty quick for Boule as we just need to do 8 actions in sequence (in two separate logs, although we can do it in one too):

1) The Controlling Faction selects one issue and places it on
the 2 space on his end of the Faction track => Aristocrats - Scott

2) The Controlling Faction selects one issue and places it on
the 2 space on his end of the Faction track => Agiad - Michal

3) The Opposition Faction selects one issue and places it on
the 1 space on his end of the Faction track => Demagogues - Brent

4) The Opposition Faction selects one issue and places it on
the 1 space on his end of the Faction track =>Eurypontids - Brian

5) The Controlling Faction selects three issues and places
them on their side’s center (zero) space. => Aristocrats - Scott

6) The Controlling Faction selects three issues and places
them on their side’s center (zero) space. => Agiad - Michal

7) The Opposition Faction selects two issues and places them
on their side’s center (zero) space => Demagogues - Brent

8) The Opposition Faction selects two issues and places them
on their side’s center (zero) space =>Eurypontids - Brian

Look what happens between 7 and 8 - some of the issues are bound to specific War/Peace conditions. If till 7, nobody have chosen War/Peace, Athens has dilemma if they should play Colony (pretty powerful issue) counting on Sparta choosing War/peace in 8. But for Sparta it is beneficial that Athens has one moot issue, so maybe Sparta will not play War/Peace in 8. All in all, for Athens to be sure they can play Colony, they have to "sacrifice choice" and take "War/Peace" which in itself is kind of wasted issue, as it will not enable them to do anything on the map.

Wow, enough. Please tell me I have over-intellectualized it and ask me to shut up as we are playing friendly, test two-rounds scenario:) (However, I really love all those tiny mechanics of Pericles like one mentioned above :)

What do you think guys? I am open for all options, and it seems Brent's is least time consuming :)
15 12/16/2017 9:36:00 PM Turn 1 Demagogues Message Thanks guys.

Ready to go. A few things about the Boule and Assembly phases.

In the interest of time and efficiency, pairing off to do these is really the way to go. Playing in real time is even better. Scott, i was going to suggest we do this for your first if we can coordinate a time....I'll email you.

I'll make separate Dropbox folders for the two city states to use. Playing the assemblies in tandem does create dyssynchronous logs. This is easily sorted by choosing one faction's log as the primary log to continue with going into the theatre phase (usually the faction that will be first in honour order)....the other city state just needs to advise him which issues were won by which faction, the revised honour scores, and the positions of the Favour of the Assembly and Assembly control markers, so that he can update those in his log.....then they discard their hands and redraw their won Strategos in the continuing common log when they reach their first turn to place issues. Sounds fiddly but it works very well.

When debating we found pretty quickly that using the pawn method to mark the debated issue was potentially confusing, particularly if choosing an issue in a stack, as it's in 2D not 3D as it would be on the board. There is a secondary option from a right click menu on the issue which allows you to highlight it with a border, which seems to work better. It's also useful for clarity to actually announce what you're doing in the text field (this will be particularly important in the theatre phase, where it can sometimes be difficult to spot where an issue has been placed).

Some players have encountered a problem with their leader card being masked and unable to reveal it from their hand. Thread is here:

https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1877089/problem-revealing-leader-cards-vassal-module

It's never happened to me but it has been happening to my city state colleague in another game I'm playing. Not sure why it happens to some people and not others. It's not a huge issue if it happens because we know what the leader cards do and they are only used in the assembly phase, so if it happens to you, you can just announce when you are playing your leader, either for a debate or for the Strategy Board.

....and Michal, yes peace creates a very interesting strategic challenge and opportunity......if one of us doesn't debate to go to war of course :). We'll find out soon enough.

14 12/16/2017 6:27:00 PM Turn 1 Agiad Message My set-up done, to the Boule segment, starting with Athenians. I just noticed reading the rules of this scenario it starts in peace which is interesting situation for game-play mechanics :)
13 12/16/2017 3:13:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Message Got it - and that does make sense. Keeps the log straightforward and you can't game the Vassal system. What would be the benefit of cheating in a Vassal game...?

Okay, I've not played Pericles yet (really wanted to, though), so I'll probably need some hand-holding. I went ahead and did my setup.

To the Agiad for their initial setup. Then Boule.
12 12/16/2017 4:22:00 AM Turn 1 Demagogues Message Thanks, Brian, and sorry Scott. You had asked me about this and I probably wasn't clear enough.

While this feature of ACTS is just used for the journaling of a game, I understand that it's also used for card management and dice rolls for other games which have modules. That does duplicate Vassal and I think its function is to ensure fair play....it's technically possible to cheat in Vassal PBEM by discarding a log with a result you don't like and replaying until you get one you do. I don't understand why anyone would do that in a game and wouldn't see the need to use that function myself. I do think the journaling ability is a great way to manage communication for PBEM games, though.


11 12/15/2017 6:09:00 PM Turn 1 Eurypontid Message You have it correct, Scott. We are using ACTS to send e-mail and automatically keep a journal. Then use VASSAL to record the actual game play.

It doesn't really matter who goes next, so you may as well be the next one to go.
10 12/15/2017 3:57:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Message Thanks for your patience - I haven't yet used ACTS before, so I'm thinking this takes the place of email, correct? That is, we make notes and email through this system so that it logs everything? And then use VASSAL for the actual gameplay?

Finally...who is up?
9 12/15/2017 3:28:00 PM Turn 1 Eurypontid Message I have drawn my hand and placed my entourage cards.
8 12/15/2017 2:51:00 PM Turn 1 Demagogues Message Thanks for picking that up, Brian. I did the log on the fly at work on my 11 inch notebook and somehow picked some poor kid from the Agoge to be ostracised......Spartan schooling is meant to make them men so if they can't handle a harmless bit of 10 year exile, they're not fit to be Spartiates! By all means fix it when you post your next log, thanks.

Something a bit screwy is happening with Dropbox. Both the log and the .sav file are in my Dropbox folder on my notebook and the solo randomiser log I mentioned is on its own in the same folder on my desktop computer, but the other folders aren't. I haven't encountered this before. I'll try to work it out but if you wanted to go ahead from the .sav file, the next log will be 102.
7 12/15/2017 9:38:00 AM Turn 1 Eurypontid Message Hi Brent,

Thanks for setting this up. A couple of things I noticed...

First, I only see the "Setup.vsav" file out in Dropbox, but you mentioned there should also be a "log" file as well. I just wanted to see how it was named so we could all follow the same naming convention.

Second, it looks like you put the "Agoge" issue on the Eurypontid issue track instead of "Ostracism". They look kind of similar. I can correct it when I do my turn at drawing my hand if it hasn't been corrected already.


6 12/14/2017 9:04:00 PM Turn 1 Demagogues Message Hi guys.

Everyone's on board and the game is set up and ready to go. I did semi-random faction assignment....... this is Scott's first game, so I've paired him with me. I did the randomisation in a log of the solo module because the multiplayer one has no die roller. I thought I'd uploaded it to the Dropbox folder but it's not there. I'll post it tonight but it's not part of the continuing game log so you don't need to see it if you're happy.

Factions are:

Aristocrats - Scott
Demagogues - Brent
Eurypontids - Brian
Agiad - Michal

I've posted a setup log including the first Aristophanes card for Turn 4 ....Frogs C, which has put Ostracism onto the Opposition tracks. I've also drawn my hand and formed my Entourage.

There's also a Setup save file if you want to skip the log and go straight to the start.

I've played a couple of turns PBEM of a longer game and we've worked out some tricks to make it run more smoothly. I won't overwhelm you with all of them now but will make suggestions as we get to the relevant stages. To start, it's much quicker if we pair off for our assemblies and even quicker if we can arrange to do them in real time.

For notation convention, I've started with log 101, next to post will be log 102, 103, etc. When we do the second turn we'll go to 201, 202, etc

I've not used ACTS much before and there's no Pericles module but found it to be a really neat tool for journaling the game. Group emails are sent from the game page and a running log of messages is kept there, rather than having to hunt for individual emails in your mailbox. You can also send private emails from the page. You can access it by logging into ACTS and finding the Peace of Pericles game in your game library (under Generic Modules) but each group email also has an ACTS link attached.

Before we go to the Assembly phase, each player now needs to draw their hand and do their Entourage, following from the previous player's log....it doesn't matter which order we play in for this, just as long as it's logged sequentially.

Looking forward to it.
5 12/14/2017 3:19:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Change Player 3 player Player 3 player changed from Brent Steeves to MichalK
4 12/14/2017 3:18:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Change Player 2 player Player 2 player changed from Brent Steeves to Brian Marrs
3 12/14/2017 3:17:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Change Player 1 player Player 1 player changed from Scott Vranes to Brent Steeves
2 12/14/2017 3:17:00 PM Turn 1 Aristocrats Change Player 0 player Player 0 player changed from Brent Steeves to Scott Vranes
1 12/14/2017 3:15:00 PM Turn 1 Demagogues Change Player 1 player Player 1 player changed from Brent Steeves to Scott Vranes

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