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Entry # Time Turn Player Title Entry
148 4/1/2019 8:01:00 PM Turn 18 Jeff Message Hi Enrico, I want to let you know that I am back home and should be able to log moves at a better rate now. I believe that it is your turn to move your A1/A2 units.
147 3/26/2019 6:09:00 AM Turn 18 Jeff Message Hi Enrico,

I want to let you know that I am departing on a business trip tomorrow and most likely will not be able to log any additional moves until next Tuesday, April 2. I will let you know if there are any changes in either direction.
146 3/23/2019 5:27:00 PM Turn 18 Jeff Message Miss! SP -1 to 5 for LT
Hopefully, that move will be legal. Over to you for A1/A2…
145 3/23/2019 5:25:00 PM Turn 18 Jeff Die roll request Request: 10-sided die x 1

7


Message from Jeff:
roll for B2 HW Missile at A2; PK=4
144 3/23/2019 5:24:00 PM Turn 18 Jeff Message Third Move for B2:

advance turn marker to turn 18

B2 ID=0 (7) CL +2 (14) SP -5 (6) move 4 hexes
Turn Mode is 3-2=1 for 1st turn
Move: 1 LT 3 RT and then Fire HW missile
PK = 4


143 3/23/2019 4:19:00 PM Turn 18 Jeff Message After reading your comments and thinking about my last move, I agree with you. I was assuming the reduction in the turn mode number for the change in altitude would apply throughout the B2’s turn. Therefore, after the initial turn at DD20, I continued to use the modified turn mode number of “2” instead of “5” (which is the turn mode number solely based on speed). However, that does not make sense. The turn mode number can only be reduced for the first turn (i.e. when B2 is in DD20) when the altitude change actually took place.

After that, B2 has reached the new altitude and already taken advantage of using the change in altitude to make a tighter turn than normally possible. All subsequent turns must therefore use the turn mode number solely based on the jet’s speed.

I will redo the move again. Hopefully, the third time will be a charm! Sorry for all of the redoes!
142 3/23/2019 1:23:00 PM Turn 18 ecz Message no problem for the re-do of the move, but I think there is a problem with your turns. Details are in the log.
141 3/23/2019 8:21:00 AM Turn 18 Jeff Message Back to you for A1/A2's move. I apologize for all of the confusion. Let me know if there is anything that you do not agree with...
140 3/23/2019 8:18:00 AM Turn 18 Jeff Message A Miss!

Complete move: 1 TLT 1 TRT

SP -2 to 8 for TLT
139 3/23/2019 8:11:00 AM Turn 18 Jeff Die roll request Request: 10-sided die x 1

9


Message from Jeff:
B2 fires on A2 w/ HW missile; PK=5
138 3/23/2019 8:08:00 AM Turn 18 Jeff Message New Move for B2:

advance turn marker to turn 18

New move: B2 AB=2 (5) CL +3 (15) SP -1 (10) move 7
Turn mode = 5-3=2
Move 2 LT 3 RT
fire missile: PK=5
137 3/23/2019 7:46:00 AM Turn 18 Jeff Message After thinking about this a bit, I have figured out what I will do going forward:

1. I will redo my move using the correct speed columns and will redo the missile launch if possible.

2. If the missile launch is a hit, then there will be no difference.

3. If the missile launch is a miss, then I think we should ignore the first roll and play on. In the case of a miss, if you feel that we should keep roll from the original missile launch, then I am ok with that as well and you can remove A2.

I am enjoying playing this game again after so many years and am also enjoying playing against you very much. Therefore, I am not too concerned about winning or losing, but rather relearning the rules and enjoying some good games!

I am going to redo my last move now.
136 3/23/2019 7:34:00 AM Turn 18 Jeff Message Hi Enrico. Yesterday, when I made my move, I was rushing to try to complete my move before I went to work. Now, I see that I used the "subsonic" column to determine my speed. I should have used the "Supersonic" column. I am willing to redo my entire move to correct.

I think that it will be possible to make a move so that I still can get a shot off at A2, however, I will reroll the missile launch as well. Are you OK with that?
135 3/22/2019 6:21:00 AM Turn 18 Jeff Message Let me know if everything looks ok to you. If so, then over to you for A1 move...
134 3/22/2019 6:19:00 AM Turn 18 Jeff Message Bravo 2 scores a hit, A2 eliminated

Continue move:
2 TLT 1

SP -2 for TLT to 9
133 3/22/2019 6:18:00 AM Turn 18 Jeff Die roll request Request: 10-sided die x 1

2


Message from Jeff:
PK = 5
132 3/22/2019 6:17:00 AM Turn 18 Jeff Message Correction, A2 is using AB, so no -2 correction.

PK=5
131 3/22/2019 6:12:00 AM Turn 18 Jeff Message Advance Turn Marker to 18 TRC

B2 Mil=0 (6) CL 3 (15) SP 0 (11)
Turn Mode is 6-3=3
Move 8
2 TLT 3 RT Fire HW Missile

PK 5 -2 for Mil = PK 3
130 3/21/2019 2:13:00 PM Turn 18 ecz Message new INIT
B2 23
A1 19
A2 19
129 3/21/2019 2:13:00 PM Turn 17 ecz End Turn
128 3/21/2019 2:13:00 PM Turn 17 ecz Message A1 MIL = 1 (10) Lev L (14) SP +1 (5) mov 4 WTL 1
A2 AB =2 (9) C A +4 (15) SP -1 (4) stays in place
127 3/19/2019 5:49:00 PM Turn 17 Jeff Message Thank you for the offer to let me change my move.
However, I will keep my move as is.

You may go ahead and make your moves for A1/A2.
126 3/18/2019 8:56:00 PM Turn 17 ecz Message feel free to change your move accordingly the new position of A1
125 3/18/2019 8:55:00 PM Turn 17 ecz Message ok never seen that advanced rule but I get what you mean. a plane cannot turn if I change altitude so quickly in so little space. Makes sense. So I would stay pointed to NE (no turn at all, just alt change in-hex II33)
124 3/16/2019 6:47:00 PM Turn 17 Jeff Message I will make my next move in any case, that way we can keep the game moving.

B2 Mil=1 (7) DR -4 (12) SP +1 (11) Turn Mode is 6-4=2
move 3 WRT 4 WRT

Over to you to for A1, A2...
123 3/16/2019 6:34:00 PM Turn 17 Jeff Message Yes, as far as the fuel is concerned, I need to make sure I keep enough to get away if needed!

One thing, on A1's last move, A1 moved 0 spaces as conducted a WLT. However, according to 13.2.1.1, the turn mode can never be reduced to less than "1". Based on that rule, I would think that A1 committed a "Tight" turn not a "Wide" turn. A1 moved "0" hexes or 1 less than the turn mode. Do you agree with that interpretation?

If so, A1 would suffer a -2 speed loss which would reduce its speed to less than 3. If you agree with that interpretation, then you can redo the move if you wish to prevent the stall.

I have not read any of the other advance rules, so if you know of other rules that may be applicable here, let me know and I'll take a look as well.


122 3/16/2019 1:02:00 PM Turn 17 ecz Message it's interesting to discover if fuel can become a factor in the end game. Curious to see what's going to happen
121 3/16/2019 12:59:00 PM Turn 17 ecz Message new INIT

B2 26
A1 18
A2 16
120 3/16/2019 12:58:00 PM Turn 16 ecz End Turn
119 3/16/2019 12:58:00 PM Turn 16 ecz Message A2
ID = 0 (11) DR -1 (11) SP + 0 (5) move 5 (1 + 4 WTR)

A1
AB = 2 (11) CL +4 (14) SP -1 (4) move 4 stays in place WLT
118 3/16/2019 11:11:00 AM Turn 16 Jeff Message B2 Speed corrected to 9

B2 Mil=1 (8) DR -1 (16) SP +2 (11) move 5 RT 5 RT

SP -1 (10)

Back to you ...
117 3/16/2019 11:05:00 AM Turn 16 Jeff Message I agree that the basic rules do not disallow such a maneuver and imply that would be ok in any case. Making my next move in a moment.
116 3/16/2019 9:45:00 AM Turn 16 ecz Message so please consider my planes one hex further along the same direction and proceed, I'll correct their position in the next log

115 3/16/2019 9:44:00 AM Turn 16 ecz Message I agree on everything. sorry for the mistakes about acceleration.

about turning I have seen a thread on BGG where the game designer is reported to allow this interpretation.

But also the basic rules, while do not state this plainly,in my opinion imply that it's a legal manouvre
114 3/16/2019 9:34:00 AM Turn 16 Jeff Message Enrico, I agree that my speed loss should have only been -1 during my last turn. I will correct before my next move.

On your last move, A1 and A2 both dove with a AB throttle setting. Therefore, I think the speed changes on both should be +3 (not +2). If you agree, then I think both jets wound need to move 1 more hex forward and increase their speed by 1. Turning radius is the same for a speed of 5 or 6 so no impact to their maneuvers.

As far as your turning maneuver itself, I have no issue with that (taking credit for altitude level changes to decrease the effective turning radius). In fact after reading the advance rule 13.2.1, that is exactly how the game is supposed to be played. If you are ok with it, I propose that we play according to 13.2.1 going forward. It will allow for some better diving and climbing maneuvers.
113 3/15/2019 9:48:00 PM Turn 16 ecz Message new INIT
B2 25 (or 26)
A2 17
A1 15
112 3/15/2019 9:47:00 PM Turn 15 ecz End Turn
111 3/15/2019 9:47:00 PM Turn 15 ecz Message A2
AB =2 (11) DR -1 (12) SP +2 (5) move 4R

A1
AB =2 (13) DL -1 (10) SP +2 (5) move 4L
110 3/15/2019 9:44:00 PM Turn 15 ecz Message unless you flee I'll try to shot down your plane if I have an opportunity. So we can continue.

Note this turn I have made a manouvre with both planes I would be sure you agree is correct as I believe.

As ALT change is technically *movement* in the plane's hex, actually a plane can count the ALT change as hexes travelled before the turn. It's better explained in the file.

finally I think you should subtract at the end of your last move 1 SP (per Normal turn) not 2 SP per tight turn


109 3/15/2019 8:11:00 PM Turn 15 Jeff Message If the opportunity presents itself, I will dive down and try to engage, but obviously being out numbers 2 to 1, I would not be surprised if no additional shots are fired.

Do you want to play this game out or do you want to stop here?

I am ok either way and would be glad to try a second game if you prefer. What would you like to do?
108 3/15/2019 8:06:00 PM Turn 15 Jeff Message Clear Moves

B2 Mil=1 (9) LR 0 (17) SP 0 (10) move 5 RT 5 RT

SP -2 8 for RT
107 3/15/2019 7:13:00 AM Turn 15 ecz Message new INIT

B2 27 A2 16 A1 14

unless you risk to remain w/o fuel (= ID for the rest of the game trading ALT for SP) in the middle of the map pursuing my planes I believe that probably we'll not see any other shot

106 3/15/2019 7:09:00 AM Turn 14 ecz End Turn
105 3/15/2019 7:09:00 AM Turn 14 ecz Message A2 MIL =1 (13) L R (13) SP -1 (5) move 2 TRT 2 TRT 1
SP -2 (3)

A1 MIL -1 (15) D L-1 (11) SP +0 (5) move 2 TLT 2
SP -2 (3)


104 3/14/2019 9:00:00 PM Turn 14 Jeff Message Clear Moves

B2 AB=2 (10) LR 0 (17) SP +2 (12) move 5 TRT 5 TRT 2

SP -2 (10)

BTY...
103 3/13/2019 8:37:00 PM Turn 14 ecz Message new INIT

B2 27
A2 19
A1 17

102 3/13/2019 8:37:00 PM Turn 13 ecz End Turn
101 3/13/2019 8:36:00 PM Turn 13 ecz Message A1 ID = 0 (16) DA -3 (12) SP +1 (5) move 2
A2 ID = 0 (14) DA -1 (13) SP +0 (6) move 5

end turn
100 3/11/2019 9:54:00 PM Turn 13 Jeff Message You are correct, B2 should have decreased its speed after B2's the last move. However, the decease in speed should be -1 because B2 made normal turns (not tight) with a "Mil" throttle setting. I will decrease B2 speed to 5. Let me know if you do not agree.

Decrease B2 speed to 5 for turn 12 move.

B2 AB=2 (12) DR -4 (17) SP +5 (10) move 6 WRT

Back to you for A1/A2...
99 3/11/2019 8:46:00 PM Turn 13 ecz Message new Turn INIT

B2 24 (SP 4 + ALT 21 = 25)
A2 20;
A1 19;

please adjust B2 SP to 4 as I think you should lose 2 SP for tight turn last move
98 3/11/2019 8:44:00 PM Turn 12 ecz End Turn
97 3/11/2019 8:44:00 PM Turn 12 ecz Message A1 ID = 0 (16) D A -1 (15) SP +0 (4) move 3 A

A2 AB = 2 (14) D L -1 (14) SP +3 ( 8) move 7: 3 TTL 3 TTL 1 and SP drops to 6
96 3/10/2019 9:47:00 AM Turn 12 Jeff Message B2 Mil=1 (14) LR 0 21 SP +1 6 - move 6 - 3 RT 3 RT

over to you for A1/A2 ...
95 3/10/2019 8:14:00 AM Turn 11 ecz End Turn
94 3/10/2019 8:14:00 AM Turn 11 ecz Message A2 ID = 0 (16) D L -1 (15) SP +0 (5) move 4 WTL
A1 MIL = 1 (16) LEV R (16) SP +1 (4) move 4 WTR
next Turn INIT
B2 26
A1 20
A2 20
93 3/9/2019 3:09:00 PM Turn 11 Jeff Message Update TRC
Clear Moves
B2 ID=0 (15) DL -2 (21) SP 0 (7) - move 5 - 3 TRT 2
SP -2 (5) for TRT
Back to You...
92 3/9/2019 2:20:00 PM Turn 11 ecz Message new Turn (11) INIT (forgot to update the TRC in the VASSAL file sorry)

B2 30
A2 21
A1 19
Back to B2
91 3/9/2019 2:18:00 PM Turn 10 ecz End Turn
90 3/9/2019 2:18:00 PM Turn 10 ecz Message A1 ID =0 (17) D A -1 (16) SP -1 (3) move 2 A
A2 AB = -2 (16) D L 1 (16) SP +2 (5) move 4 WTL

89 3/9/2019 12:30:00 PM Turn 10 Jeff Message No Problem!

B2 move:

B1 AB=2 (15) LR 0 (23) SP +3 (7) move 7 - 3 RT 3 RT 1

over to you...
88 3/9/2019 10:44:00 AM Turn 9 ecz End Turn
87 3/9/2019 10:44:00 AM Turn 9 ecz Message sorry for delay

A1 ID= 0 (17) C A 4 (17) SP -4 (4) stays where is now
A2 MIL =1 (18) L A (17) SP -1 (3) move 3 A
end turn
starts Turn 10

new INIT
B1 27
A1 21
A2 20
86 3/5/2019 9:32:00 PM Turn 9 Jeff Message One more thing, after B2 move:
B2 -2 (4) for TRT

Back to you for A1, A2....
85 3/5/2019 9:26:00 PM Turn 9 Jeff Message Nice Shot, well Played! Just like the Cowboy Americans to fire without warning on a training mission!! :)

The murderers will pay!

I am unable to move A1 back to LL21 but note its actual position.

Delete B1 Markers on ASC.

B2 AB=2 (17) CR 2 (23) SP +2 (6) move 4 - 2 TRT 2 TRT

Back to you...
84 3/5/2019 8:06:00 PM Turn 9 ecz Message A1 should be in LL21, sorry, I moved it one extra hex
83 3/5/2019 7:47:00 PM Turn 9 ecz Edit Victory Points ecz: from 0 to 2
Jeff: from 0 to 0
82 3/5/2019 7:45:00 PM Turn 9 ecz Message B2 moves...
81 3/5/2019 7:45:00 PM Turn 8 ecz End Turn
80 3/5/2019 7:44:00 PM Turn 8 ecz Message A1 ALT 13 SP 8
A2 ALT 17 SP 4
B2 ALT 21 SP 4
INIT
B2
then A1 or A2
Turn 9 starts
79 3/5/2019 7:23:00 PM Turn 8 ecz Message looks like that, barring mistakes, I have killed your B1 !
78 3/5/2019 7:22:00 PM Turn 8 ecz Die roll request Request: 10-sided die x 1

4


Message from ecz:
PK 8 but you are IDLE (-4) so final PK is 4
77 3/5/2019 7:21:00 PM Turn 8 ecz Message A1 AB =2 (17) DR -3 (13) SP +4 (8) move 5 R 3 TTR 2
I can fire a missile to B1 from LL20

76 3/4/2019 7:33:00 PM Turn 8 Jeff Message B2 Mil=1 (18) CA +4 (21) SP 0 (4) no move on board

Back to you for A1...
75 3/4/2019 6:44:00 PM Turn 8 ecz Message A2 ID =0 (21) DL -1 (17) SP +0 (4) move 3 WTL (SP 4)

now B2
74 3/4/2019 6:43:00 PM Turn 8 ecz Message new turn
INIT
A2 22 - B2 21 - A1 20 - B1 18
so
A2
B2
A1
B1
73 3/4/2019 6:42:00 PM Turn 7 ecz End Turn
72 3/4/2019 6:41:00 PM Turn 7 ecz Message Alpha 1
AB 2 = 19 LR (16) SP +2 (6) move 2 TTR 2 TTR 2 TTR final SP 4
71 3/3/2019 7:59:00 PM Turn 7 Jeff Message B1 Mil=1 (21) DR -2 (15) SP +2 (5) - move 2 TRT 1
SP -2 (3) after TRT

Back to you for A1...
70 3/3/2019 6:49:00 PM Turn 7 ecz Message A2 MIL = 1 (19) C L +3 (18) SP -2 (6) move 3 TTL

then A2 loses 2 SP (4) for tight turn
69 3/3/2019 12:53:00 PM Turn 7 Jeff Message Sorry Enrico, you are correct. correct move should read:

B2 ID=0 (19) DR -1 (17) SP 0 (6) move 2 TRT 2 TRT 1

Therefore, B2 should be on hex GG21 facing SE

Speed would still be reduced to 4 after the move so the ASC is correct.

I will create a new vassal log and correct the move now.

Then over to you for A2...
68 3/3/2019 7:57:00 AM Turn 7 ecz Message sent log
you orders are:
B2 ID=0 (19) DR -1 (17) SP 0 (6) move 2 TRT 2 TRT 2 TRT SP -2 (4)
but I believe you move only 5 hexes for dive 1
67 3/3/2019 7:55:00 AM Turn 7 ecz Die roll request Request: 10-sided die x 2

6
8


Message from ecz:
tiebreaker for
A1
B1
both at 20 INIT
66 3/1/2019 7:57:00 PM Turn 7 Jeff Message Turn 7
Mark Turn 7 on TRC
Clear Moves
Inits B2 (24), A2 (23), A1/B1 (20)

B2 ID=0 (19) DR -1 (17) SP 0 (6) move 2 TRT 2 TRT 2 TRT
SP -2 (4)

over to you for A2...

65 3/1/2019 7:43:00 PM Turn 6 Jeff End Turn
64 3/1/2019 7:43:00 PM Turn 6 Jeff Message Vassal will not let me Move A2 to BB21. You will have to correct on your next init.

B1 Mil=1 (22) LR 0 (17) SP +1 5 move 5 - 2 TRT 2 TRT 1
SP -2 (3)

End Turn

63 3/1/2019 6:58:00 PM Turn 6 ecz Message A1
ID = 0 (21) dive A -2 (16) SP 0 (4) move A 2

A2
MIL =1 (20) Climb +2 A (15) SP -1 (8) move A 7 (missed one hex in the log, please adjust the position of A2 to BB21) thanks
62 3/1/2019 5:39:00 PM Turn 6 Jeff Message Turn 6

Inits A1=22, A2=22, B1=21, B2=25

so init order is B2 A1/A2 B1

Bravo 2
B2 Mil=1 (20) LL 0 (18) SP +1 (8) move 3 TLT 3 TLT 2
B2 SP -2 (6)

Over to you for A1 / A2 ...



61 3/1/2019 5:22:00 PM Turn 5 Jeff End Turn
60 3/1/2019 5:22:00 PM Turn 5 Jeff Message Correct A2 position, move back to BB14

Bravo 1
B1 Mil=1 (23) CR +3 (17) SP 0 (6) move 2, Tight Right Turn (TRT) 1
B1 TRT = SP -2 (4)

End Turn 5

59 3/1/2019 12:23:00 PM Turn 5 Jeff Message Enrico, in your last move, I believe that with an altitude change of +2, and a final speed of 9, A2 should have only traversed 7 hexes. That would put A2 in hex BB14. Do you agree with that?
58 2/28/2019 7:26:00 PM Turn 5 ecz Message Alpha 2A AB 2 (21) Climb +2 A (13) SP + 0 (9)
moves 9 Ahead

now B1's turn
57 2/28/2019 5:45:00 AM Turn 5 Jeff Message Tight Turn, so SP -2 (7)

Back to you for A2 move...
56 2/28/2019 5:41:00 AM Turn 5 Jeff Message Enrico, you are correct. Sorry about that! Let me redo the move. I will create a new log files as well.

Corrected move:


B2 AB=2 (19) climb L +4 (18) SP -1 (9) Move 5 hexes w Tight L turn after 4.
55 2/27/2019 8:57:00 PM Turn 5 ecz Message B2 starts its turn at SP 10

I suspect you considered B2 as subsonic (< 10) when actually it is supersonic (10+) and then speed loss is -2 if you climb +3/+4
54 2/27/2019 8:53:00 PM Turn 5 ecz Message you wrote
"B2 Mil=1 (20) climb L +4 (18) SP 0 (10) Move 6 w Tight L turn after 4"

but I think that if you climb + 4 at MIL with (H) acceleration being supersonic at the beginning of the move (10) you should record SP -2 (8) and not SP 0 (10) thus moving only 4 hexes
53 2/27/2019 7:59:00 PM Turn 5 Jeff Message B2 after tight turn SP -2 (8)

Over to you for A2 move...
52 2/27/2019 7:57:00 PM Turn 5 Jeff Message B2 Mil=1 (20) climb L +4 (18) SP 0 (10) Move 6 w Tight L turn after 4.

51 2/27/2019 7:42:00 PM Turn 5 Jeff Message Watch those G Forces Alpha 1!!

One thing, A1 went to an altitude of 18 which is above the BG max of 15. However, I am ok if you want to ignore the BG limit on max altitude. I am going to make my next move assuming we can go to any altitude. If you want to agree to a limit or redo your last move, let me know.
50 2/27/2019 6:36:00 AM Turn 5 ecz Message B2 now...
49 2/27/2019 6:32:00 AM Turn 5 ecz Message A1 ID=0 (21) climb L +4 (18) SP -5 (6) Moves 2L with a tight L turn

Next 100 entries

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